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 Does "person" as a tangible necessarily denote hum 
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Post Does "person" as a tangible necessarily denote hum
Did a session yesterday using the cue Earth/most intelligent non-human lifeform. In S4[X] the word "person" was one of the percepts. I also got "angel" but I declared that as an AOL due to lack of S, D, AI, or EI to back it up.

"Person" doesn't always denote human, does it?


FYI: ST showed this person "greeting" another lifeform connected to a motion arrow that appeared to be going away. (Elvis has left the building!) They were surrounded by eight other smaller lifeforms playing, working, guarding, and guiding.

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Tue Nov 13, 2007 3:24 pm
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Goatman, you specifically cued "non-human" there. A lot would depend on what you had in your Sensory column. "Life form" is defined as a"mature organism," eliminating artificial life, i.e., super-computers. This would narrow things down to mammals (great apes, whales and dolphins, for instance), visiting ETs, or our Bigfoot friends running around in the woods :) .
Post your session for review or put your TRN up in the Advanced section for some others to run and see how that works out. Have you done a movement off any of the ST elements?

--Snow

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Tue Nov 13, 2007 5:59 pm
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'Intelligence' is a broad search term. From my understanding of the true definition, you either posess intelligence, or you do not.

*shrug*

What do you REALLY want to know?


Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:13 pm
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Please forgive me for posting my original question from the coffeehouse with the free high speed internet connection instead of from home where my records are.

The TRN was [ 8158 / 7777 ]

The actual cue was:

Earth/most intelligent non-human creature/present time

If I'm reading my Webster's correctly, a life-form must be a corporeal being, but a creature may be non-corporeal. Does that change the question? I don't think so:

Is a "person" necessarily a human?

For RVRobot: I picked up this cue at last January's Capstone workshop. It was one of the Major's treats for us that I copied into my target pool. It's been sitting there all these months waiting to jump out and screw with head when I least expected it.

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Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:36 pm
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RV Robot:

I hope to God that your "What do you REALLY want to know" statement does not imply (to you) that a viewer's personal intent and/or perspective, whether conscious or unconscious, has any bearing upon how the Matrix adjudicates this -- or any -- formalized RV search term!

If so, then, verily, I say unto thee, the wrath of Doom will descend upon your wretched head for failing to apperceive a veritable cornerstone of RV.

Let us pray...for the robot.

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Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:32 am
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Okay, I'm going to climb out on this ledge and take a stab at answering my own question. As Snow pointed out, I did specifically cue "non-human" and my data indicates that some non-human creatures are persons. I'm gonna go with that for now. The nuns probably told me that in grade school.

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Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:00 am
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Chartless,

I'm just wondering what kind of intelligence you picked up? It looks like the cue as formulated could easily pick up a dolphin or elephant as an intelligent lifeform. Both of those critters have big brains and exhibit higher level cognitive traits like elephants mourning their dead.

Were you enquiring concerning some sort of extra-terrestrial type of non-human lifeform?

-Mike

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Thu Nov 15, 2007 7:58 am
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Ed Dames wrote:
RV Robot:

I hope to God that your "What do you REALLY want to know" statement does not imply (to you) that a viewer's personal intent and/or perspective, whether conscious or unconscious, has any bearing upon how the Matrix adjudicates this -- or any -- formalized RV search term!

If so, then, verily, I say unto thee, the wrath of Doom will descend upon your wretched head for failing to apperceive a veritable cornerstone of RV.

Let us pray...for the robot.


Certainly not... thats why we must choose our cue with precision. The statement was a sanity-check to see if the cue really pointed to what he wants to find out.


Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:56 pm
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michaelruiz wrote:
I'm just wondering what kind of intelligence you picked up? It looks like the cue as formulated could easily pick up a dolphin or elephant as an intelligent lifeform.


The cue and the TRNs I used are written above. Run it yourself--it ain't no elephant! When we worked it as part of the capstone course, the group got really interesting data, but I don't think "person" was part of it. The interesting thing to me now is that the most intelligent non-human creature on the planet seems to be going away and another most intelligent non-human creature is taking its place. Unless I missed the target. Sad to say, that happens sometimes. Wish I had time to look into it, but i really gotta learn how to draw on the right side of my brain first.

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Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:52 am
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That is kinda spooky Chartless :shock: One going away and another taking it's place...... yikes......

I'm adding this to my target pool too.


-Mike

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Sat Nov 17, 2007 5:14 am
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Chartless,
Very interesting target.

Sometimes it helps to examine an ST like when we analyze dreams.
Combine the collective conscious concepts with personal concepts and AOL/S comparators.

Example: Dreaming of being afraid and naked in school worrying people will see you and then everybody notices but does not care.

Collective conscious association: Being naked = Exposing Bare Identification or truth.
Personal conscious association: Being naked for one person might be associated with ideas of shame or vulnerability

Collective conscious association: school = place for education
Personal conscious association: A school for one person may be associated with the idea of peer review and peer pressure.

If you put the 2 together: The dreamer is feeling vulnerable that his/her peers will not accept him/her for who they are but on the inside recently learned (school) that people really do see them for who they are and accept them anyway.


I find it very difficult to identify a target on a persons st that does not pass the monkey test unless i examine AOL/S comparators in the same way.

Example: A target for one of the people i am private tutoring was an elephant.
There were strong aol/s with the concept of a circus and a slow moving aol/s structure.

I asked the viewer during analysis; what comes to mind when i say the word circus?
His answer immediately was: elephants doing tricks,
I asked, does this also fit the description of your slow moving structure, he said yes so i showed him the feedback. Just a photo of an elephant in the woods.

-----------------------

That being said, i would love to know the aol/s you had in the session. It could shed a bunch of light on this target. In fact i would like to see the whole session if you wouldn't mind posting it, this is a very interesting and almost spooky topic.

when i see someone with a finger pointing and only 2 people. The one pointing would represent to me an authority figurer of the two.

Are you sure this "person" is being replaced or has been cast out of earth and not the other way around? Like perhaps it may have been cast out from somewhere else and perhaps ordered here?

With that kind of cue, personally I would be afraid of the chance of remote viewing Lucifer.

Just a thought.


Sat May 03, 2008 12:27 am
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JayBird,

Wow. Where were you six months ago? I still have the session, but it is buried in a storage locker right now along with most of my library and last year's session logbook. I'm not inclined to go dig it out right now, and without it I can't answer any of your questions. Sorry.

I've got to tell you, I don't like the dream analogy. Dreams are a nasty mish-mash of memory, imagination, problem solving, metaphor, entertainment, etc., etc. One particular image doesn't mean the same for everybody, and doesn't even necessarily mean the same thing to one person each time it shows up in one of their dreams. I'm working hard to avoid having to "interpret" my RV sessions. I'm trying to train myself to just report the facts. Interpretation is not analysis; it's an error source.

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The path to perfection has only two rules:
Rule 1: Begin. Rule 2: Continue.

Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Sun May 04, 2008 11:17 pm
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JayBird wrote:
I asked the viewer during analysis; what comes to mind when i say the word circus?
His answer immediately was: elephants doing tricks,


That sounds a lot like a poor cousin to a Stage 5 exploration of an AOL.

_________________
The path to perfection has only two rules:
Rule 1: Begin. Rule 2: Continue.

Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Sun May 04, 2008 11:22 pm
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Chartless,
Uh six months ago, i was involved with my gold hunt sessions and suffering from some sort of blood poisoning. Sorry. While trying to catch up, i saw your post and was intrigued.

Yes the dream world is indeed a mess of the unconcious that the conscious mind has difficulties with. This is why we extract data bit by bit. As RV is a product of the unconcious mind, i find that verbally exploring aol/S after sessions, helps a lot, even if its long after the session is complete. Not everyone can draw a near perfect ST, this helps those who are still struggling in that dept.

Next to following protocol, feedback and sleep is probably the most important things for the unconcious mind to improve on the quality of data it gives.

Some people are dimensionally blind at first. It is really frustrating for them to see their ST not look like the target as soon as others who may be more artistically inclined. Until sessions pass the monkey test, this is just another way to let people know they were getting relevant data even though they may not see it in the sketch. It also shines additional insight to the target that only the viewer can give. The better a person can identify the target in their session at feedback time, the faster we improve. Ingo was so strong about this idea, he even went as far to say that RV is not RV without feedback.

Although what i was doing sounds "a lot like a poor cousin to a Stage 5 exploration of an AOL" the viewer was not in session. I was just helping someone identify a target long after the session had been finished.

We are all working hard to avoid having to "interpret" RV sessions, unfortunately not everyone is able to reach that level as soon as they want.

And i would have to disagree about aol/s interpretation, if the only words that fit at the time are an aol/s, only the viewer can tell you what he perceived. Ed used a similar technique with the roller coaster session feedback trying to get the class to identify the target through process of elimination. Comparators are how we deal with ideas that we don't have words for at the time, just because a protocol has not been published for its use, does not mean we cant use them. If i can get a viewer to accurately (and it is accurate) call out their target after the session is complete, only by looking at their ST, i have done my job as a tutor. The goal is to identify the target.

Yes, not everyone has the same meanings to concepts and objects, and the meanings may change. We have common ideas that change and personal ones to pair with it. This is why it helps to ask those questions. These are ever changing so a person cant assume it means the same for everyone always so it helps to clarify it.

When a person has an aol/s, they usually know what they are perceiving, they just don't have the right words or they would not use the comparator. This needs to be fleshed out for clarification. Using comparators to weed out the concepts that don't fit the target are part of analysis. I don't give the target feedback freely to those i tutor. I make them try to figure it out by their data first. If a person can more clearly state what they meant with the comparator, the data can be more precise and help with feedback.

Thank you for the lesson in humility. I will try to avoid ruffling your feathers in the future.

Best of luck,
Jaybird


Mon May 05, 2008 10:12 pm
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Professor JayBird,

As a goat, I have no feathers to ruffle. I am often gruff merely because I am a goat.

Being a goat in good standing at the petting zoo, however, it pains me that I am not familiar with "the monkey test". Could you explain it to me?

And a reminder to those who've forgotten: Stage 5 is not done "in session". It is done offline and is an interrogation of the viewer's memory, not really remote viewing the way stages 1 thru 4 are.

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The path to perfection has only two rules:
Rule 1: Begin. Rule 2: Continue.

Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Tue May 06, 2008 11:31 pm
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Professor Gruff McGoat,

I believe the term "Monkey Test" was coined by Alex.

viewtopic.php?t=1433&highlight=monkey+test

If you are in good standing at the zoo and nobody told you, its probably because of a conspiracy some say was started by the monkeys. Trouble makers they are.

Well now you know.


Wed May 07, 2008 4:01 am
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Hmm. While monkeys may dream of starting conspiracies, they are completely incapable of keeping a secret long enough to actually implement one. Regular chatterboxes, they are.

Regarding "The Monkey Test", Alex wrote:

" The " Monkey Test" as I have said in past e-mails with team members, "even a monkey could identify this target from my sketches"

He also wrote:

"I find that if I demand better accuracy I get it. Which means, I have to actually "rip-up" my work with some "drama" and scold myself when the work is not perfect, do it again and it magically..... becomes...... perfect work! "

I think I'm going to emulate Alex for a while.

_________________
The path to perfection has only two rules:
Rule 1: Begin. Rule 2: Continue.

Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Wed May 07, 2008 5:05 pm
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I find my shredder gives me a lot of satisfaction for that purpose too but i imagine physically tearing it is better.


Wed May 07, 2008 5:50 pm
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I'm fond of crumpling and tossing, myself. I throw the unsatisfactory junk as far from me as I can. Maybe I'll try the shredder next time. It is positioned handily near my desk.

_________________
The path to perfection has only two rules:
Rule 1: Begin. Rule 2: Continue.

Lessons from the Petting Zoo:
Lesson 27. Puppies that spend all day yapping never really learn to hunt.


Wed May 07, 2008 6:02 pm
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Chartless wrote:
I'm fond of crumpling and tossing, myself.


Goats tossing and crumpling themselves, ouch, sounds terrible. Isn't there something the zoo vet can prescribe for this?

On another note, the sight of 37 or more pages of your hard work being one by one slowly chewed into thousands of pieces can be rather humbling.


Thu May 08, 2008 7:38 am
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